Close, yeah - there are amp sim pedals, but those don’t load IRs for the amp sim. IR’s are basically cab sims.
At the really high end there are profiling amp sim preamp/amps like the Kemper and Quad Cortex that can do similar things to IR sampling with real amps and model the real amp off their samples, but that’s also not the same as impulse/response files.
IR = cab sim
Dedicated software (plugin or in modeling pedal) = amp sim
profiling amp sim = amp sim that can sample a real amp and mimic it, like IR does for cabs
and of course there’s also analog and digital hardware pedals that can give amp-like tone too. Most Darkglass pedals, all the Tech-21 pedals, BDI-21, etc.
I have the Fender Studio 40, not appropriate for ‘playing out’.
That said, I do like your thought of plugging my pedal chain with BK7 into the return loop.
I will give this a shot for ‘clean sound’, but still doesn’t help my ‘big boy amp’ need.
My advice would to buy the Harley Benton big boy head and use a any other preamp in the FX loop for different sound signatures. The HB is a class-D ICE power amplifier which is good. I got this idea from a guy on Talkbass and lots of people are following this route.
This route is a lot cheaper then buying different heads. You can use any cab with this depending on what sound you after. 2x10 = more mids, 1x12/15 = more low
@DaveT has considered this route too IIRC. And if I ever want amplification again I am going the powered PA speaker route and put an amp/cabsim in front of it for the bass.
Good thing you mentioned this Howard. This is were it gets confusing because those IR’s are amp/cab sims mixed. But most of us normal folks just play with amp sims and cab sims (ir) separate.
The Darkglass Microtubes 500 I owned had an ICEPower power amp stage OEM board just the same as the Harley Benton does. I’ve had those ICE boards on the bench in the lab for product development and they are clean as clean can be. The only thing that makes a particular product using that board clean or not is whether you have the ability to set the tone control stack flat. I never measured it, but I’m pretty sure noon on the darkglass is flat. The Aguilar tonehammer I have also uses the same ICE board.
If one likes lego bricks for modular flexibility and doesn’t mind the quantity of little boxes they have, the Harley Benton could easily be a forever clean power stage with preamp pedals for tone.
So @DaveT what would the pros/cons be of the Harley Benton vs. the Darkglass other than cost?
I assume both Darkglass 500 amps AO and Microtubes have the same power circuit, So buying the Microtubes is really a repeat of my B7K, right? So if I went that route I would prob look to the AO instead just for variety.
It’s the same tradeoff as any integrated vs. component system.
With any integrated amp you get more in one box. Less pieces of gear. Less cabling. Less to go wrong with interconnect. Less to set up. Possibly less expensive than buying individual pieces.
I think the key thing is exactly what you have hit on . . . can you set it flat? If you own a Darkglass Microtubes and set it flat, there’s no problem using a Tonehammer preamp pedal in front of it to drive its ICE power stage. Et voila you now have a Tonehammer amp too. The only real drawback to that is being stuck with all the knobs on the Microtubes and the cost of it if you really don’t end up using it long term. It’s more stuff to get twisted and wasted money if it isn’t a long term tool you want to use.
The advantage of the Harley Benton is mostly that it’s the cheapest cost power stage that you can put anything else (preamp tone) in front of and change out as your tastes change. But with all the sacrifices of not having the integrated system advantages. I wish the Harley Benton had an EQ bypass switch to not worry about knob twisting to get it flat. If I bought one I’d probably go in and hard wire around their EQ circuit. I don’t know if they’ve done anything to color the tone before the power amp stage. Again, can it be set flat?
I know when I set me B7K flat, it is truly flat, so I would assume the same thing would be true as the electronics are the same in the amps as far as I know.
I kinda like the idea of the Alpha Omega 500 as it gives me all the flex of that pedal too, not that I really need it, its just fun.
So if I read it right, the Harley Benton is the same power stage, and then if say, I ever wanted a different front end tone, I just buy preamps. I could do this with the Darkglasss as well, just paying for more bells and whistles.
The Darkglass AO 500 amp is $800, the AO Ultra alone is $449, so the power amp is essentially $350
The Harley Benton 800 is $352 (converted) but 800 watts.
This is very interesting.
There are way too many options, but I like this line of thinking.
I assume I don’t need more than 500 watts for ‘playing out’.
The Harley Benton has 2 cab outs, the DG 500, only 1.
There are. More bells and whistles on the DG outside of the AO/EQ circuit, but not sure I really need them.
Finding a used AO Ultra would be easier as well.
For the Harley Benton, how does the preamp sound set flat, is this transparent as well? If I don’t use an external preamp, is the onboard one a good one? With the Darkglass AO, I know the preamp circuit is good and clean as well. Asking for ‘what about a stripped down setup, no external preamp.
@Paul another dumb question set…for the Harley Benton…
Does putting the preamp (B7K) in the return of the effects loop bypass the HB preamp? Yes right or am i getting it wrong?
If I just run it in my signal chain into the bass input to the amp through the preamp and set all the controls to flat, is it the same thing essentially?
You plug your signal cable in the B7K and route that in the return. That way you bypass the whole preamp of the amp. So you don’t use the front input at all. Personally I like this route because I’m a bit of a purist. Even on flat there is still a sound signature of the preamp but I think most people aren’t bothered by this. So essentially you could say it’s almost the same thing.
The Harley Benton gets ton of good reviews. I would just look on YouTube for how it sounds and visual reviews. I’m guessing Harley Benton would go for a transparent since they are a product driven company.
You can use any cab with this depending on what sound you after. 2x10 = more mids, 1x12/15 = more low
Personally I like this route because I’m a bit of a purist. Even on flat there is still a sound signature of the preamp but I think most people aren’t bothered by this. So essentially you could say it’s almost the same thing.