Do we have to choose a bass path?

Ed · November 12, 2021, 10:57am

That’s pretty much what I do - I’m just feeing a lack of concrete progress in any one direction

akos · November 12, 2021, 11:08am

Well that’s where the “I don’t care about genres” comes in. When learning to play Jeremy I am learning to play bass, not learning to play “90s US west coast alternative grunge rock” or whatever genre it is. Similarly, when I was learning Born Under a Bad Sign, I was learning to play bass, not blues specifically. I am progressing in playing bass, not in playing individual genres.

John_E · November 12, 2021, 11:39am

I think there is a point where many get to (I think I am there too) that you either need to sit in your basement and play for hours (like a teenager) or get with other folks and play stuff - or you will creep slowly forward forever. Sure, you can do lessons. Sure, you can learn more songs. But, an hour a day or every other day only yields so much alone in a room.

Also, I always liken this point to a diet. Start a diet, drop lots of pounds. Then spend a year trying to get that last bit off.

howard · November 12, 2021, 11:41am

I have neither the ambition nor desire to be a session bassist

I listen to a lot of genres but mostly I only am interested in playing post-punk, dark/synth/cold/new wave, electroindustrial, and 4AD/indie kind of stuff for my own styles.

Ed · November 12, 2021, 11:43am

This is the major bummer with me. It’s getting really frustrating playing ACDC songs in front of the mirror in the evenings but I simply don’t have the social life to find bandmates.

Jazzbass19 · November 12, 2021, 12:08pm

I’ll agree with what @howard said:

And I would further add, that (as usual), it depends on what your goals are!! If you want to be an active gigging bassist in a band that plays on weekends at your local pub, for example, then you had better be as general as possible . . .

Cheers
Joe

Ed · November 12, 2021, 12:15pm

I dream about that, @Jazzbass19 - the money, the beer, the groupies and (most of all) the fun. Unfortunately the closest I can get to it is playing at churches and weddings with my wife’s band and they want me to learn to read music. I think most of the local cover bands I’ve seen in my area go for classic rock anyway so I’ve got a head start. Point taken tho

howard · November 12, 2021, 1:02pm

You should! It’s not hard. Sight reading at full speed is hard, but it’s not necessary. Reading music is a useful skill even if you never get to that level.

HowLowCanYouGet · November 12, 2021, 1:17pm

I think it’s always best to be aware of all genres because there is always something to learn from and to add to your playing ideas. I definitely don’t think it’s a good idea to try to learn the bass using songs though. All you’re learning is the song in each case.

You’re much much better off learning general competences that can be transferred to any song and any genre. Learn the fretboard completely, scales and arpeggios, sight reading, some theory in relation to chords, ear training with the intervals, techniques, and most importantly, rhythm and timing. And always play with a metronome.

You can decide what genre you want to play as you’re improving.

Ed · November 12, 2021, 1:33pm

I don’t know - I appreciate that practising scales etc may offer a high yield in the long term and it may be very transferable to other genres, but I just find this kind of work too abstract. It’s also difficult for me to apply the knowledge to practical examples.

I prefer covers because they’re fun to play and I can acquire the skills and theory to meet my immediate goals by working with the pieces themselves. OK this style of training is probably going to restrict me to a genre but that’s cool. For now anyway

akos · November 12, 2021, 2:23pm

I’m doing a mix of the two. I’m doing the Ariane Cap music theory book, and also learning new songs on my own at the same time. I then try to apply the music theory stuff to the songs I play, and try to figure out what’s happening in the song and why (what are the chord progressions, what scale degrees I am playing, etc.).

At the end of the day, my primary goal is to be able to play covers of songs, and to have fun in the process. I’m doing the music theory stuff because it’s beneficial, but I don’t find it fun on its own. I have to distract myself with songs, because that’s the part that I enjoy. I would not be able to complete the book in any other way, it’s just too dry and boring.

numberman2000 · November 12, 2021, 2:37pm

It really depends on what you want to do…I play in a cover band and have to be as versatile as possible.

My recommendation is play all the stuff you like. Then play stuff that is interesting. Then play the hard stuff. This is entirely subjective, of course.

The hard part is what do you learn? Take something like “Schism” - that’s an awesome song, and I love playing it…but we’ll probably never play it in this band. I’m totally OK with that. I loved learning it and love playing it. We play it occasionally in rehearsal, but never on a stage.

I’ve also been playing at church since last year. That’s 99% major scale, diatonic stuff. Almost entirely plagal cadence (some form of 1-6-4 chords). But…that made me such a better player. Made me a better musician. That’s a great, great gig if you can get it. And it’s not slap / pluck stuff…I think it’s called ‘modern worship’ - plus I get paid to go to church…how awesome is that??

Anyway, I guess what I’m trying to say is there’s no ‘right’ way to do this. The advice I was given when I picked this up was “learn everything” - not the greatest advice but I now understand where that comes from. Being versatile is a very valuable attribute. And if you plan on gigging in a cover band, that’s what you’ll need to be. You don’t have to be perfect, but you’ll need to flex in and out of genre pretty quickly. And audiences love the fact you can go all over the place.

This was our setlist from last Saturday night (we have a female lead vocalist and we all share other vocals - I sing La Grange et. al. – also, we take “Before He Cheats” and mash it with “Dream On” - same key, same chord progression ):

HowLowCanYouGet · November 12, 2021, 2:41pm

But those scales and the theory and the techniques apply to EVERY song that you will ever want to play. They are the basic TRANSFERABLE tools. On forums I see countless number of people saying “I’ve been playing the bass for 10 years, I can play this song and that song, but I can’t play the bass. I don’t know what to play in a jam or with the band when asked to improvise”. No surprise there!

After each song, try to make a list of everything that that song has taught you about how your bass playing has improved.

Akos has it right when he says “I then try to apply the music theory stuff to the songs I play”. This is the correct way. A song is just applied theory, and it doesn’t work backwards. By playing songs, you’re applying theory that you’re not even aware of, and then hoping to learn by osmosis. You may end up learning the wrong way to play the bass, because at this stage you won’t know right from wrong or good from bad.

Jazzbass19 · November 12, 2021, 3:00pm

GREAT post there, @numberman2000 . . .

Looks to me that you’re doing quite well, too. Lots of experience and an interesting and varied set list as well.

Cheers
Joe

LeftyChad · November 12, 2021, 3:01pm

I would absolutely go see this band!

numberman2000 · November 12, 2021, 3:27pm

Thank you.

I think what I left out was that I play with really, really good players. Effectively two lead guitarists. Objectively better than me (I’ve been at this for three years in earnest).

What that makes me do is force me to up my game.

If anybody has read “Talent Is Overrated” - recommended by our fearless instructor, Josh, it talks about living outside your comfort zone and pushing yourself. That’s what I try to do. Something new, more difficult.

And my band mates, who are friends, push too. I really like the challenge. And we function well together.

I think that’s a challenge, too. Finding people you click with and everybody’s game gets elevated.

“Greater than the sum of the parts” kind of thing.

numberman2000 · November 12, 2021, 3:51pm

Next gig is at The Barn Whiskey Bar in Mont Belvieu, TX next Friday night!

howard · November 12, 2021, 3:53pm

That’s a loooooong set

Really varied too, cool.

Ed · November 12, 2021, 3:57pm

Whoa that is one heck of an impressive set list!

I guess you practice the pieces you need to play with the band, and then have other study pieces like Schism to give a challenge and work through some more exotic stuff? I’m trying that with some classical pieces now - they’re quite rewarding to play as a solo artist but I’m probably not going to play them live ever. I’m trying to kind of balance the time between the fun stuff and the hard stuff. But yeah it’s hard to know what to learn…

Got anything on vid?

howard · November 12, 2021, 4:03pm

1-6-4 is a great progression in minor keys though (I actually like 6-4-1 and 6-5-1 a lot).