Pickups / new ideas, old faithfuls, reviews and discussions

unless you really want flatwounds, I would put the money for a set of strings towards a new pick up for the Ray 4. There average about $100 to $120 US, but there are a couple of decent pick ups for about $50 or less.

The ONLY weak point on the Ray4, IMO, is the pick up. It is way HOT, and it is not wired like a real Stingray pick up is (parallel is the right way, this one is wired in series), and there is no easy way to change it to parallel.

You can get a Kent Armstrong MM pickup for only a little more then a set of flat wound strings, and you will get way more the result you are looking for, if you want to MELLOW out the HEAT.
I personally use an Aguilar, but they are about $120, and the next pick up I get will be the Kent Armstrong, cuz for the price, they are supposed to be great.

@T_dub, that actually sounds very logical. Thank you. Yes, perhaps a better MM pickup would be the way to go. I’ll have to think about it. Speaking of MM pickups, just for fun and also down the line (lathe first!!) I’m thinking of buying a kit J-bass and routing out the cavities to put in two BumHuckers :slight_smile: , sort of like an HH arrangement. I love the feel of a J-bass (when we had the bit of COVID reprieve last year I went and noodled with one in the store), but I don’t love the tone OF THE pups.

Anyways, the first bass I’ll mod will be the P-clone, and I will be modding that. Just wanted opionions on my choice of Seymour Duncan Steve Harris SPB-4s. What would be the main difference between them and SPB-2 and SPB-3?

1 Like

I am no expert in P bass pick ups, or anything other then an MM Stingray Pick up (and I still would not qualify as an expert, probably not even an assistant to an expert), however, based on my limited research, and the desire to get and mod a P bass sometime soon, my choice would be the EMG Geezer Buttler pick ups. I love the sound of them when compared to quarter pounders, and other P pups (although, I have not listened to them all, or the Steve Harris one next to the Geezer pup).
I may be biased, because although I do love and appreciate Steve Harris, I would say Geezer is much more influential on me.

I am sure that your pup choice will sound great and of course, it should be a big improvement over the stock pup. If not, then you might ask the question if it is worth the upgrade.

for instance, I upgraded my Ray4, and this was a long time before I had even watched a LOBSTER video with all the Ray4 pick up and pre-amp mods, I had just talked to some people that told me how happy they were with their pick up upgrades.

I plugged in my Ray4, and noodled a little Sublime “Date Rape” with the old pick up, and then unplugged and did the pup swap, with the Aguilar. When I plugged in, I was only one note into the same song, and I can only imagine the look on my face when I heard that sweet sweet gold to my ears. I must have looked like a cartoon with my jaw dropped to the floor.

I expected a difference, but not a completely different bass.
At the time, I did not have any EBMM Stingrays, and had not played any thru an amp. I had only played my Ray4, and my Ray34 a little bit.
Now I have EBMM Stingray with original pup and preamp, and my Ray4 with the stock preamp and Aguilar pick up.
If there was not a couple differences between the two basses, I would be hard pressed to tell the difference in a blind sound test.

My Ray4 is a 2 band EQ with stock Ernie Ball Slinky strings (my preference, so why change them"
My EBMM Stingray SLO Special is 3 band EQ with DR Neon Orange Coated Strings.
So, yeah, I can tell the difference from the strings and possibly a difference if they are both flat and I boost the mids, or if they are both boosted and I kill the mids, but otherwise, my Ray4 is as good as an EBMM IMHO

That is why the Sterling (SBMM) Stingray Ray4, for $300 US dollars, is one of the best, if not the best bass buy in the $350-$400 and under range. They are so well constructed, they look awesome, and sound (well, er…) really cool.
Unfortunately, they made the Pick Up on it a bust. i am positive it is a marketing thing, because if they did not make it this way, they would have a very hard time explaining the mark up on the Ray24 which is $499

The pick up on the Ray 4 sucks, and it is wired and potted as such that you can’t just switch the wires to being in parallel instead of in Series.
The Ray24 has a very similar pick up, with a similar problem, in the fact it is wired in series instead of in parallel, however, you have access to the wires, and if you are capable, you can change it in about 5 minutes with a screwdriver and soldering iron.
So, with the Ray24, you can still just swap out the pick up, but if you don’t want to have to spend the money doing so, you can just change it and get a better, more classic Stingray sound. That does NOT mean the pick up is very good, it still is pretty hot and begs to be replaced, but you can live with it for a while and not have to resort to putting flatwounds on it, or play it with the bass and treble cut all the time.

The Preamp in both basses is identical, even tho the website kind of words it as tho the Ray24 is upgraded from the Ray4.
I personally do not have a problem with the Preamp in the Ray4, it is adequate and meets my needs, but others rather turn it into a 3 band, and match the EQ to the Preamp when replacing them as a kit or combo.

There is a video with Lobster when he put the same Aguilar pick up I have, in a Ray4, using the stock preamp.

He then did a later video where he added the Aguilar Preamp to the bass, so it was a combo Pick up and Preamp.

I personally don’t hear much difference, and the difference that I hear, ever so slight, is not better or worse, just a little different, mostly with the addition of the Mid cut / boost to the preamp.

The Pick Up cost me $119. The Pre-amp is around $159, so together is it roughly $280. I would have to think LONG and HARD about putting $280 into a $300 Bass.
But to add $120 to it, was way worth it. It really is SOOOOO MUCH BETTER with the upgraded pick up, it is night and day.
However, to put another $160 into the bass that you now have $420 invested (bass cost plus pick up cost), and just get a little difference in tone adjustment with the 3 band pre-amp, to me is not worth it. YMMV, to others, that 3 band might make a huge difference to their recordings or sound on stage, or just if they like the idea of having more tonal possibilities. To me, it is not.

I can use my Behringer BDI-21 Bass Driver Pre-amp if I want to play with mids, or many of my pedals, and even on the amp itself, so it is not worth it for me.

The exception to that rule might be the Darkglass Tone Capsule pre-amp. It is actually not much more then the Aguilar, if not the same price, and that sucker adds a WHOLE RANGE OF TONAL POSSIBILITIES. Geared more towards the hard rock, punk, metal, death metal, etc… then classic tones, but it sure is fantastic if that is what you want to turn your bass into.
This video is after Lobster did a complete upgrade on a Ray4, with a $500 budget (I think, it might have been the Mold Smoothie that was $500 budget instead of Mint-0-Ray). Then he added the tone capsule and demoed it. It is freaking incredible, however it is much less like a stingray and more like and ESP LTD or Schecter in sound.

That is another awesome thing about the Ray4. They are so CHEAP, yet SO FLEXIBLE with so many possibilities for upgrade, you can have a couple adn they can all be completely different sounding instruments, with that same classic Stingray look that I love so much.

Here is the Mint-O-Ray after it was completed with the Darkglass Tone Capsule pre-amp (Delano pick up).
There are 4 other videos from the start to finish of the project before this one, if you are interested, they are pretty cool to watch, as are all his Ray 4 pup and preamp modification videos / reviews.

2 Likes

I fully understand that, @T_dub . . . :wink:

Cheers
Joe

1 Like

in the end it is not about doubling the price of the bass that concerns me. If you do the Pick up and Pre-amp, it is every-bit as good as the $699 to $899 Ray34’s (almost), and way ahead of the Ray24. Its about the Preamp upgrade itself, essentially it does not add $160 worth of tone, over the stock pre-amp.
I mean, the pick up itself so greatly bridges the gap between budget bass and EBMM sound, when you come in with the Aguilar Pre-amp (IMO, for my ears), you can barely notice much, as I stated before. little more eq options, but thats it, it is not pushing that pick up any differently ass far as I can tell, and the pick up made the bass.

To me it is wasted money. I like my 2 band pre-amp. it does a good job for a cheap preamp. But it makes that Aguilar sound like gold. I ask, is gold enough, or sould we risk another $160 to see if we can put in the matching preamp and see if we can make is sound like Platinum.

Leaving me with the question, is platinum better than gold. Gold is prettier, has been a long time standard, and is worth way more than I am. Gold is soft with a rough exterior, and can be shaped loosely to very tight.

Platinum is not really as striking looking (and I am not talking about bass hardware, cuz gold hardware is not for me) platinum jewelry, watches, items, they are rigid, look to be super 1 dimensional, and could just be plain harsh.
For people that want platinum, add the preamp.
For those that are happy with gold (and saving $160). just add the Pickup

I like the 3 band on my Stingray Slo Special

2 Likes

I don’t want to make it sound like I think upgrading pre-amps is stupid and you should only upgrade the pick up.

I am saying that about the RAY4 to an extent, but there are so many basses and many really shitty preamps out there, and those basses need rescuing too.
Also, there are many great pickup / preamp combos, where they are designed to work together, and some do it very good.

So, preamp upgrades are awesome in many situations, even necessary in others, it just so happens that Sterling made a budget, entry level bass so good, they had to do something to make it sit far enough below the next two levels they offer, at higher price points, and they just crammed the biggest, hottest pc of crap pick up in there they can find.
Funny thing is, the Ray24 is not too far off from it. It is just a little lighter shade of brown pc of shit pickup too.

More about that in this thread (link coming) because I just wrote a big thing about the differences between the Ray4 and Ray24, and if you are talking those, you have to talk Ray34 as well. It started all innocent, focusing on the pick ups of the three, then the preamps, then this and that and that and this again…lets just say it got out of control.
But I will post that in another thread and link it here when it is posted.

I don’t think we have a Sterling Stingray thread, for WHAT REALLY IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SBMM Rays. I know I post in random other threads, when people ask, but the info isn’t really collected in one spot is it? I know it’s in places like Bass Porn, or GAS, or Upgrade day, or wherever somebody old or new asks. It is all spread out all over the place, and I think it’s time to bring it all together.
If you know about one that is specifically stingray, and more specifically Sterling by Music Man Stingray, please PM me the link.
I will look around before making one.

Edit: I found that Stingray thread, and remembered I posted a bunch of stuff there, but it was still random, I am thinking more of a SBMM RAY thread, leaving EBMM out of it completely.
There are WAY too many variations and customs and BFR over the history of the Stingray for me to even know 2% of that info.
So, still considering the new thread for now, stop me if need be.
Plus, I will delete this edit and everything after the link to the new thread once I get the thread doing, or merged, or found.

1 Like

What is this craziness

image

The Jay-Ray 4!

2 Likes

I’m waiting until they add the lipstick from Danelectro.

2 Likes

Ideas for pickups in a fender aerodyne?

It has the passive EMG PJHZ pickups in it and I’ve got these in my Bello bass already and. It a huge fan (upgrading the Bello bass to the Bello active set.

So what are my “go to” options to consider and why? Don’t know much about PJ sets.

1 Like

Wilkenson makes a cheaper version of that pick up also.
I believe Herrick pick ups do as well, that is the first Delano I have seen like that.

1 Like

A few Nordstrand options there @John_E similar to what’s on some Ibanez basses. I have a set on my SR650 and they are versatile.
There’s also Seymour Duncan sets available and I would imagine most of the manufacturers would stock versions of this layout.
I recently bought some cheap nasty Chinese humbuckers and to be honest they not half bad. I think they rushed me $30 delivered :joy: and I have seen PJ sets on eBay

1 Like

Audere active bass preamp selection pothole warning. If you are going to use an Audere preamp with Delano exposed pole pickups, use the Classic version and not the Pro Z version. The Pro Z version places half battery voltage across the pickup. Touching the exposed pickup pole and the grounded string will make a large pop. Pickups with insulating covers are no problem.

2 Likes