I know you mentioned you’re looking for a physical device, but for the occassional change-up, I can recommend using Looper.Tube (https://www.looper.tube/) to watch backing tracks. You just paste the link to the video into the online player and it has options to loop all or part of the video as well as change the tempo. One of the added bonuses is that you don’t get YouTube ads so much easier to focus on your playing. You could have a few different URL’s to backing tracks saved in notepad or something and just paste them in.
I bought the Mooer Micro Drummer and have the Boss RC-3 Looper (discontinued) but never really cared much for either of them. I was using them with guitar and wanting a distorted tone and couldn’t figure out an easy way to include them in the signal chain without colouring the beats.
I’m most likely to find myself just chucking on some midi beats in either EZdrummer 3 or Addictive Drums 2 via their stand alone apps. If I get really into it, I’ll whip open Reaper and get the same groove going and record my jam.
What I gathered from the research I’ve done the Boss RC-5 has a decent feature set (supports MIDI), very good sound quality for the looping part, drum sounds are not that great (lots of samples to listen to on YouTube) and it’s not the most straightforward in use. The RC-10R is supposedly the more drum oriented looper but I’ve seen mostly mixed reviews. I also didn’t find the drum kits and rhythms sound significantly better than the RC-5. The RC-500 is in the same price range and is supposed to be the better looper (2 track looper to start with).
When I say the drums don’t sound good though that’s in comparison to the BeatBuddy devices. If that doesn’t matter to you then the Boss could very well acceptable. There is a YouTube channel named Guitar Grotto Studio that has several videos about different loopers (not many Boss though) that I found helpful, comparing them in features, sounds and so on - for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6ngWWxjyiY that one has the RC-5.
From a feature point of view I liked the Nux Loop Core Stereo (but the drums sound like a toy) ; the Valeton GP-200 has 2 loops and better sounding drums. The Boss devices may be more reliable and should sound better (32 bit/48 kHz vs 24 bit/48 kHz) but I’m not sure how noticeable that will actually be. I also like how the Donner Circle Looper sounds for the money it costs (also a popular selection if you ask Reddit) and there are clones from various brands (Flamma, Kmise, …) if that one is not available.
Just my research from YouTube/Reddit and such, so depending on what you want to do and need from a looper you might have entirely different ideas!
Thank you! I have used LooperTube in the past and it’s a very helpful tool. I’m looking to complement this with a hardware-only solution.
As to having a separate looper and drum machine, from what I understand either:
you have effects > drum machine > looper > amp in the signal chain, are not using high gain on the amp or onboard effects (in which case the drum machine and looper should go in the fx loop); if the drum machine and looper don’t sync over MIDI this has your looper recording the drums and then playing them back. Otherwise the drums and loop will go out of sync in as quickly as a few bars
or you have more flexibility if looper and drum machine sync over MIDI; then you could have your drum machine elsewhere in the signal chain, in the fx loop or have it output to something like a monitor speaker
Integrated looper/drum machines shouldn’t have this issue in principle.
This is what I gather from research, if I’m wrong I’m sure someone can fill in gaps or correct me!
This is another case where it matters if you’re using it just for practice or as a musical instrument. Since you don’t plan to use it as an instrument it matters less, but personally I would always want them to be entirely separate signal chains (and mixer/interface inputs) and sync to a MIDI clock (either external or from the drum machine). This is how it would work as a standalone instrument. The BeatBuddy would be a very poor choice for this (in that you can get a lot more capability for less).
The BeatBuddy is made for inline use in the signal chain. I would not put it before the looper (as otherwise the looper will also loop the drums) but then yes you will want to sync them. I would put the BeatBuddy almost last in the chain (or in the amp effects loop after everything else).
While waiting for the BeatBuddy to go back into stock at Thomann I’ve ordered a NUX Loop Core Stereo Loop Core Stereo - NUX Audio after watching way too many videos on different loopers.
Decided on that one because it’s very easy to use (the Mooer GL100 looked even easier but has a few things against that I didn’t like) Single button, but so is the basic Ditto I’ve been using. It has a rhythm machine that sounds like an 80s toy but that’s where the BeatBuddy will come in; sync over MIDI.
I like that you can very easily store backing tracks on the device with the device appearing as a regular USB mass storage device, no special software needed that may or may not work or go outdated/unsupported. Stereo in/out and different routing options.
The feature set is comparable to the Boss RC-5 with a more simple UX. Lower sound quality (24 bit vs 32 bit for the Boss), won’t be an issue for practicing though.
Basically giving you more pedal switches to hit different accents on different bits of kit - only useful for someone performing and using this as their drummer, not really a thing for practicing at home.
Which is exactly how I use mine. I much prefer to practice with drums vs. a metronome. Mine is on my desk, connected directly to Line Inputs 5 & 6 on my DAI using a stereo 1/8” to dual mono 1/4” “Y” cable. The big Boss-style paddle switch is easy to operate by hand. I don’t think I’d like the pushbutton switches on the v2 BB.
Product segmentation, the BeatBuddy 1 in (its 10th anniversary costume, no Boss style foot size switch) is kept in the range, likely at or close to the price point it has now. 144 EUR for the Mini 2 and 549 EUR for the BB2 so price wise there’s definitely room for it in the middle, where it is now at 349 EUR; I also guess they won’t want to make the price difference between BB1 and BB2 too large so the upsell is a bit easier.
Having said that I would also welcome a sale I want to get the BB1.
As @John_E says it does look like the additions and new features are more useful if you want to use it for live performances, so the value proposition of the original hasn’t really diminished if practice is the main use case.
I ended up selling the NUX Loop Core Stereo. I didn’t research that well enough and it only supports control through MIDI, not MIDI clock like the Boss loopers do. Caveat emptor.
I replaced it with a Boss RC-500 which works really well and the two independent tracks are getting more use than I thought I they would get, with guitar and bass.
I won’t be getting a BeatBuddy in the end. I ended up getting a Teenage Engineering KO II which looks great and is tons of fun. It’s not a drum machine per se, more a groovebox/sampler that I’ve loaded with samples from Addictive Drums that I like. It’s an awesome device to take on the couch and play with ideas and it really resonated with me and it works really well together with the Boss looper.
It also had the side effect of discovering that I like synths too, so one thing led to another and now I have a Minifreak synthesizer, learning how synthesis works with Syntorial (a really well thought out synth/ear training tool) and having a lot of fun trying to recreate things like Intro from the XX.
Somewhat unfortunate in a sense that it eats into the bass/guitar time but I find I’m really enjoying it. Also, synths are a lot more portable than basses so now when travelling I can bring a Roland S-1 compact synth and a PO-33 sampler to have fun with, both are tiny and battery powered!
Thank you, very happy with both. Bit of a steep learning curve, especially if you have to start from scratch - but I guess that would go for most synths and is also the reason to get Syntorial. I’m dividing my time between figuring things out, learning more methodically and trying to play things. Trying to decide now if I should get a Circuit Tracks as a sequencer/song builder, I can get neither the MiniFreak nor the KO II to do that as easily as I would like; playing the different instruments is already hard enough for me, so I’d like the workflow of layering parts and switching between patterns to be as easy as possible.
I would suggest just using the DAW for this, at least to start. It’s fine to use a DAW to drive both recording and also the live performance. This will work fine if you record MIDI from the synth.
Thanks Howard - I did consider that, but I’ve actively avoiding anything that involves a PC or tablet/phone app - I spend my day in front of one already and I want to get away from one. It’s also the main reason I barely play games anymore. I’m not 100% certain I won’t get the KO II to do what I want, maybe with some workarounds and changing expectations/desired outcomes - the Circuit Tracks would be partly GAS, which in synth land seems to drive new equipment purchases as much as in bass and guitar.
Circuit Tracks is a good choice. So is BeatStep Pro, and if you want to spend the cheddar, several of the Elektron instruments.
I think the sequencer on the MiniFreak is actually one of the best you can get but is is very focused around patch sequencing and not song building, more like a turbo-arpeggiator.
I want to get the BB1.
you are absolutely right! It is the multiple B style foot switch, I think more coffee is needed. Sorry!
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