Post your practice fragments!

[joergkutter]

@John_E

with all the musical notation for everything imaginable, it just occured to me that there is no notation to designate to play slightly ahead or behind.

As far as I know, this is some of these “intangible” things and thus not easily described and probably even less easily notated. @Gio once explained to me that it is - in almost all cases - considered “bad” when the bass plays behind the groove. As a former drummer, I seem to remember that it is typically easier to keep the groove if you always try to be just a hair ahead of the beat. It is really hard to explain… and do! (See also the infamous “are you rushing or are you dragging” scene in Whiplash).

[joergkutter]

@Ed

For some reason I can only hear it after I’ve recorded it and played it back…

It is often (basically always) tough to hear what you do in the moment, which is why recording yourself and critically assessing what you played is a very essential tool to improve

[John_E]

@joergkutter

in almost all cases - considered “bad” when the bass plays behind the groove

I dunno about that.
Blues, some funk, some jazz and some various other things need a slightly laid back groove.

Born Under A Bad Sign is a great example of needing to lag a tiny bit.

[Ed]

@joergkutter

recording yourself and critically assessing what you played is a very essential tool to improve

Oh well - maybe it’s time to find a bass tutor… if only for the human contact

[John_E]

You may be lagging just tying to keep up.
Slow it down a whisker until nailed and inch it back again maybe?

[joergkutter]

@John_E

I dunno about that.

Ha, yeah, I am beginning to doubt my previous statement myself now… and my apologies to Gio for potentially citing him wrongly. I guess it all roots in the fact that I am a “rusher” myself… and also shows how hard it is to “describe” this vs. learning to develop a feel for this!

Here is the one of the pieces of advice I got from Gio back when as I was playing over a jam track he had provided:

@Gio

The main stuff I hear to work on would be rhythm related.
It sounds like your ear is really tuned to the notes and the melodies you want the line to carry, but the rhythm feels a bit pushed through.
The rhythm could be much more accurate.
And by that, I don’t mean metronomic. I mean: the drum feel on this is a behind the beat, kinda sloppy, relaxed feel. You want to emulate that and match it on bass.
Your tendency in the recorded track is to rush, and against this soundscape and drum feel, it stands out to me.

This is a problem that I’ve had for the entirety of my playing career. It has to do mostly with what you focus on. If you’re a melody-tuned player (guilty), it is easy to focus on the notes you want to hear, and the sounds you want, and not so much on the precision of when they show up.
Guilty, guilty, guilty.

If I were your teacher, I would subscribe the following:
Find live drummer loops on youtube, or download the funk drum loops on Drumgenius (that app I love).

THEN - listen to the drum patterns until you’re singing them. Until you are feeling like you could dance to them - until they are deep in your bones. THEN - lay your left hand over the strings so they’re all muted.
THEN - play a bass line on the muted bass.
Only pay attention to how your rhythm is phrasing. The only mission is for your non-pitched muted plucking to groove completely with the drum loop.

THEN… if you’ve got it… you can play ONE NOTE. A groovy one note bass line.

That’s it.
And do that for a different groove every day, or every time you sit down to practice. Hopefully it will transition your ear a bit deeper into the rhythm.

I think this also applies to your “challenge”, @Ed

And here is a quote from Josh himself:

@JoshFossgreen

And @joergkutter, recording oneself and listening back is very often humbling, I can verify from extensive personal experience.

[Ed]

@joergkutter

Here is the one of the pieces of advice I got from Gio back when as I was playing over a jam track he had provided

Yeah I definitely feel myself locking in more with the vocals or guitar than the drums, especially if I know the song well. I’ll give Gio’s tips a go - they seem pretty solid

[John_E]

This is great @joergkutter - his advise is a really great way to think about it.

Melodies meander, grooves are grounded.

[JerryP]

@Ed ,
After reading through this post, this occurred to me. I was listening to my last cover and noticed that I was behind in the groove. I couldn’t understand why I was that far off and it hit me that I had a latency problem in the DAI/DAW settings. I rechecked and discovered that I had a 100ms issue because I was using the wrong drivers. Might be worth a look.

[John_E]

You know what @JerryP - I was gonna say you were a but behind the groove and maybe being a little ahead would “push” the drive of the song forward better but never typed it.

I think your right. Weird on the driver.
Is that for the focus rite?

[JerryP]

Yeah, it was the Focusrite. I didn’t have the Focusrite ASIO driver selected in my setup. I corrected it before I posted the video, do you still think it needs tweaking?

[John_E]

Changing the driver after you have recorded it shouldnt change what was recorded. I think.

[Mac]

Cool choice of cover to learn to cover @Ed . I was a big WASP fan around this time too ( circa Electric Circus)
I reckon you’ll have this nailed in no time!
I’m a “rusher” too especially when I know I’m coming up to a tricky or exciting bit @joergkutter . And then I’m sometimes so pleased with how I play said bit I end up lagging behind

[Ed]

Thanks @Mac ! I loved WASP in the 80s - they kind of lost it in the 90s but then again so did many rock bands I guess…

@JerryP

I had a latency problem in the DAI/DAW settings.

Good point @JerryP I’ve not yet done any proper setup on the DAI - just plug and pray - might be worth digging around a bit…

[JerryP]

I changed the driver and then re-recorded it. Comparing the timelines of the tracks showed the latency problem.

[John_E]

I went back and just listened and sounds perfect to me, so if its the same video then its me (sorry, got the 'rona the other day and in a bit of a fog).

It’s really really really good @JerryP - you’re a production powerhouse!

[JerryP]

Thanks John! I really appreciate your input.

[wellbi]

edrums (yeah, I let Ableton to quantize them ), bass and guitar … Friday evening noodling

[howard]

@wellbi

(yeah, I let Ableton to quantize them )

Just humanize them again, problem solved

Humanizing works surprisingly well.

[John_E]

Figuring out picking and sliding, need a smaller slide, and to learn the rest of the tune, lol.
Oh, and the sax part…

https://youtu.be/ULQszHjGzX8