@howard you’re a terrible influence/enabler and I have a bunch of arturia keylab 88 key weighted controllers saved in reverb now.
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My work is done 
I’m more of a synth-style keybed enjoyer myself but that weighted 88 is perfect for people from a piano background.
Yeah, it turns out I have a hard time getting past synth-style keybeds feeling like toys to me. It’s a bummer, because weighted keys are so much more expensive.
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Yeah people tend to go all one way or the other on this one, it’s like bass strings. Feel is so important.
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I fell down a rabbit hole reading reviews and the arturia has a high enough bad to good ratio that I’m thinking about other stuff.
I’m so confused by keyboard market segments though, especially weighted keys. It seems like midi controllers mostly lean quite cheap (and synth feel) or very expensive full time musician/producer versions, and there are only a handful of in between options.
Then there are a bunch of stage pianos or synths in the mid range that have nicer keyboards than the midi controllers and some midi output capability, probably with less knobs and sliders. I don’t get why mid range synths come with built in keyboards though. Getting one or two midi controllers with better keybeds just seems way better to me but is obviously not the direction the market went. Are synth players just not picky about keyboards?
On the knobs and sliders side the Korg nanokontrol caught my eye, but it seems like it should have some mortal Kombat integration based on the name.
On the keyboard side I’m now Korg D1 curious, but I think I’d need an adapter from the midi pin connector to USB to easily use it with a computer?
There’s also a Yamaha mx88 synth that seems cool. The keyboard seems like a lot of the value of that product though, which makes me wonder again why Yamaha doesn’t sell it without the synth functions.
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Hoo boy. I’ll have to get to this one tomorrow.
Maybe @wellbi can cover a bunch before I get back
I’ll let the pros chime in on the keyboards, but what you need here is a MIDI interface. Many an audio interface has that capability also, so depending on what you already have as DAI, you could be all set.
One example is the Roland Rubix 22:
A bummer since my focus rite 2i2 does not appear to have midi capability. The scope creep has already started! Really not looking for an excuse to upgrade my DAI though so that’s actually a negative.
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Yeah, OK. A simple MIDI interface alone should probably set you back no more than 30-40 bucks.
They aren’t perfect but along with Novation I think they are among the best controllers you can get. But not everyone loves them.
Venus Theory has the same one I do and he keeps going back to it despite owning many others. BTW, his channel is a really good one for making and producing music, IMO, in that he goes a lot more in to the philosophy of things; really interesting.
I think it’s more that there’s a set of price and functionality tiers. Some people prefer mini keys to full size, and others the opposite; other times, there’s additional functionality as a differentiator. One example for functionality is the difference between things like the Arturia Keystep and the Keylab, where the Keystep has a lot of functionality built in around sequencing, arpeggiating, and controlling hardware synths via CV outs. Meanwhile the Keylab is all about providing a full size keyboard and knobs/pads/etc for MIDI control of synths, often software ones in the DAW.
Then as you note there’s the digital pianos filling their role, and the straight up traditional synthesizers. These exist at many price and functionality levels too.
Then there’s the Arranger Keyboards; these are keyboards with either synth or sample based flows and a ton of built in accompaniment instruments, basically a band in them to accompany you while playing them. Basically think that these are for solo performers/composers that want a canned backing band. I always think of Lounge singers when I see these, but that’s not fair 
Actually very often they do not, the controllers are superior. Case in point was Korg’s flagship digital synths over the last few years - the WaveState, OpSix, and Modwave - all od which had garbage keyboards.
But again, not all controllers are created equal. A high end Novation is likely going to be a much nicer keyboard than many synths ship with, and many other MIDI controllers. Same for Arturia.
This is actually an option on many if not most synthesizers. In fact the module/rack versions probably account for most of the sales in some cases. Case in point, the Korgs I was just slandering all have excellent module versions:
incidentally those three Korgs are all fantastic synthesizers, I was tempted to buy a Modwave; it’s just they had not super good keybeds for some reason.
No, generally we will die on this hill
They might be riffing on Native Instruments’ naming scheme there.
Yes, you would need a MIDI interface, as it does not appear to have USB MIDI.
It looks like a nice digital piano, more of a standalone instrument than a controller, but you could use it as a controller too. I think a dedicated MIDI controller would be a better choice for a controller but it all depends on what you want.
I don’t know too much about this one. This will probably greatly surprise people here but I am not generally a fan of Yamaha synthesizers, with many reasons for this all going back to initial trauma from the DX7.
Basically the way I would think about this:
Do you primarily want to have a single master keyboard to control a mix of other instruments (in software and/or hardware?) If so, get a MIDI controller.
Do you primarily want a standalone digital piano to record, with occasional control of other instruments? If so, get a digital piano with MIDI.
Do you primarily want a very expensive hobby that takes up a lot of space but gives you a large number of keyboards to choose from, but brings a nightmare of control and audio routing with it? If so, start collecting hardware synths with keyboards
I find a single MIDI controller to be the most flexible; with it I can control a lot of other MIDI soft and hardware synths as needed. I’m never going to be Jordan Rudess up on stage surrounded by many synth keyboards (incidentally he has a youtube channel too )
@wellbi and @g13dip can keep me honest here in case they disagree or I missed anything big.
Was this somehow terrible enough to be a brand killer?
I think 70% this.
And like 30% this, although I wouldn’t be surprised if this is more aspirational than reality. I’ve gone 20 years w/o playing piano, so it’s not hard to believe I would continue through life not playing piano.
I already have too many expensive hobbies with lots of gear, so hard pass.
Besides the arturia does anyone make a midi controller <~$1k usd that I should look at? Used is fine to preferred, unless there’s bundled software that makes used not really a deal. Incidentally the arturia does have one major plus - it got SO aesthetic approval to live in public areas of the house.
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Or just get an audio interface with one built in. Solid State Labs SSL2+, Zoom U24, MOTU M4, etc etc.
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No it is (or was) the most popular digital synthesizer of all time
It was also an extreme PITA to program, and thus it was also heavily overused for its stock patches. This synth literally IS '80s pop.
This is the most common case and I think you would be best served by a controller, then.
There are some outstanding Piano virtual instruments that you could also use live.
Absolutely check out Novation, and Korg’s nicer models. I really like Novation’s offerings.
Akai also makes great stuff.
There’s also Native Instruments, who make really solid gear but with them you are also kind of buying in to an ecosystem, and it is not one I would personally jump in to at this time.
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Also re: reviews; when it comes to keyboard players, as I mentioned many of us will die on the hill of keybed feel. Many people have strong opinions strongly held here, and there’s a lot of brand affinity. I like Arturia, Akai and Novation controllers; others may swear by NI, for example, and are happy users of Komplete as well.
Incidentally if you want standalone knobs/pads, Akai has some good options there.
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Oh, you’re being a hipster. Got it
Looks like the only 88 key offering is semi-weighted which seems closer to synth keybed. I could save so much money if I could convince myself to live w/ that 
What about this studiologic keyboard?
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SL88Grand--studiologic-sl88-grand-hammer-action-keyboard-controller?cond=SL88Grandd5
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Kinda tongue in cheek. But for some reason Yamaha’s synths have never really done it for me, at least after the CS-80.
I don’t know anything about it, but it has a Fatar keybed which is generally what you are looking for for weighted actions. As I said I prefer synth style keybeds so I am not the best person to ask for weighted.
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And the Roland A-88 mkii enters the ring.
Is it fair to assume midi 2.0 is a long way from widespread adoption? I’m trying to do buy once cry once but also stay vaguely reasonable here lol
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It doesn’t really matter as there is so much vintage gear with varying levels of MIDI that it will all have to be supported forever really.
My understanding was it mostly matters more for stuff like better MPE support. I’m not in to MPE controllers so I haven’t really followed it.
I also wouldn’t worry about MPE so much - it’s another can of worms, some really cool potential but nothing has hit super widespread adoption there. I hesitate to even mention it but you’ll probably run in to it. The most canonical MPE example usually given is the Osmose:
but really there’s other interesting stuff being done for less, if that kind of expression is your thing. Me, I trend the other way, and barely even care about MIDI aftertouch
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Is that the thing where you can wiggle the keys side to side as another expression parameter? Emily Hopkins has one of those she’s very into, but that’s not on my features requirements even as nice to have.
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