I have the same tc cab and head as Josh, and the hall of fame 2 and spectracomp. I really like the whole toneprint thing, really useful and clever design.
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I just looked at a BH250 112 somebody has on offer op. I got the tone prints working… sometimes.
I think there is a trick to it, but the guy has not used the amp much, and couldn’t remember. It’s sitting in his garage.
Or
It may be defective, or glitchy.
I went to look, not buy today.
I will download the manual for that specific combo and see if I was missing anything.
Otherwise I liked the amp fine
Only
Wish it was a 210 with 2 tens instead of a 12, but I can live with that.
No fix loop. Not sure that matters, but my SWR has one.
He is asking $350. Seems high, but it was an $800 amp.
There is a Gallien Krueger 400w 2x10 for $300.
I a, gonna look. That puts tone print completely back in the pedal, but that’s not bad.
So… decisions. I would prob offer $200 for that one based on today’s test.
Will see, if I go back to it, I will start low.
It’s been listed for sale for 7 months, so he may take it.
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My amp doesn’t have toneprint, which is weird as it is one of their upper level ones, the rh 450. I just use toneprint on the pedals. And umm yeah, kinda high seeing as how it’s cheaper then that brand new
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/BH250--tc-electronic-bh250-250-watt-compact-bass-head?mrkgadid=3336039403&mrkgcl=28&mrkgen=gpla&mrkgbflag=0&mrkgcat=bass&&acctid=21700000001645388&dskeywordid=92700046937546643&lid=92700046937546643&ds_s_kwgid=58700005283382129&ds_s_inventory_feed_id=97700000007215323&dsproductgroupid=322225840303&product_id=BH250&prodctry=US&prodlang=en&channel=online&storeid=&device=m&network=g&matchtype=&locationid=9021573&creative=342707491102&targetid=aud-485786738079:pla-322225840303&campaignid=1465475243&gclsrc=aw.ds&&gclid=CjwKCAjwsO_4BRBBEiwAyagRTdrpbCdjG1wBD1v707neR5S9_gv3GF7U7AXP6uqKV1wA3ahit1RqzRoCjUIQAvD_BwE
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Oh wait, does it come with the cab, that’s not that bad a deal then I guess. I listened to some vids on the sub and up and it does sound great, but I can’t really listen to octave pedals because for me they all fall short of my pog which is just amazing imo.
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Yeah, I have heard POG’s are amazing, but I have never played with one.
It is hard for ME to beleive you can do more with a POG then a Sub-n-up based on 3 dials and a toggle vs. 4 dials, a toggle and TonePrint options, but like I said, HARD, not impossible. I have heard fpraise from so many, including @JoshFossgreen, a TC Elec player with a POG, not Sub-n-up on his board, that I GUESS it must be.
I may order one with all my Amazon credit, and listen side by side. I still could return the Sub-n-up if I fell in love with POG afterall.
Yes, the amp is a combo, they make the BG250 (tone print 250w amp head) into a combo amp, modeled BH250 instead of BG250
They come in 208-210-112-115. Two 8 or 10’s or single 12 or 15.
I really want a 210, but they ate like &800 plus.
The 12” new is over &600 IIRC, so $350 is not out of the question, but I am really thinking no more then $250.
But there are other options in that range available right now, a two by 10 Gallien Krueger for one. I bet that sounds tight.
All said and done, I really did like the sound of the TC I played today. If TonePrint proves not glitchy on it, I may get if $250 or under.
Besides, the Gallien is like a 45 min drive. This TC is across town.
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This idea cries out for its own thread. That would be really cool. 
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Yeah, I’m aware of it. That’s part of the reason I’ve been researching separate dirt pedals. I keep hoping they announce a new version with this resolved before I get around to the actual purchase. It’s been out for 12 years. Could be time for an update. The only thing it seems to need would be a level knob for the AGS.
Unfortunately, this seems to be more complicated than it sounds and the pedal would have to be redesigned.
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I would absolutely, positively want any G-K (even a MB200) over a TC BH250. But that’s just personal taste.
I actually bought a BH250 once but it was DOA. Basically it helps these days if you think of TC as an affiliate of Behringer (which they are.) As for their cheaper stuff, like all Behringer products, there are some gems and bargains to be had but you probably need to be open to the idea of needing to buy two if the first one breaks.
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Or do what I do and simply split your dirt from your preamp. I’m not sure why they are always lumped together anyways. I want a clean preamp and a fuzz pedal on the side.
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Public opinion for tc is all over the place. Some people really hate them. I’m happy with mine so I don’t care. I really at this point bypass everything and just use it as a power amp so I don’t need much. One really nice thing though about the modern amps and cabs is the super light weight.
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What makes it different is you can combine your natural sound, octave up and octave down all at once. And I just embarrassingly found out about the pog2!
- DAMN that’s expensive
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Yep the POG is basically the queen of octavers 
Well one of them anyway. Certainly the one I would get if I were spending that kind of money on an octaver. My TC Nether is fine for me - solid Boss OC-2 clone.
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Yes, you can do the same with the Sub-n-up,
But you get sub 1, sub 2, Up and Dry controls, plus TonePrint options. I am not saying it’s better then the POG, cuz Idk if it is or not, I never played thru a POG, but it seems that, as far as controls go:
Mini POG, POG and Mini Sub-n-up have same dials
Sub-n-Up has added 2nd Octave
POG2 is insane
The POG 2 is where it’s at, but $400
POG and mini POG $250 and up
Sub-n-Up $150
Mini S&U $120
If I could find a POG for $250, I would buy one just to test side by side, but there are none available (thru Amazon, where. my credit is)
Plus, I should get my IMac and GB or reaper set up first, so I can share the sound, so you guys can judge for yourselves. My saying one pedal is better then another is purely subjective. I can only say weather I think one is better then another, or equal to each other based on my ears connected to my brain.
Yes @howard, I like the Gallien Krueger as well, but I like TC too. But the sale of two items (hmmm, there has to be a pun there somewhere) is not only based on the items alone when buying used off offer up. Location, price, condition, features, sound, age, etc…
For instance, this amp is amazing, cheap, feature rich, based on the year it was put out, sounds awesome. And is pretty close to home, so at $200, seems like the best deal around.
But, it’s old, lacks modern features, is very heavy, and bulky. No headphone out, no aux in, no cab extension, etc… so it is a great deal for certain things, and would be great for small venues, but for an all in one at home amp, for things I need, not the best option, otherwise I would have bought it long ago.
I am not so sure the Gallien Krueger for sale will meet all my wants and needs either. I have not heard back from the seller to find out more about it yet, but it is on my list, and the 10” speakers are a plus as well. The 12” in the TC is good, better then the 15” I have (for playing in a small room, close to the amp). But 10”s will be better in my daily playing area I think.
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Yes, it is a good solid, inexpensive pedal for sure. Anybody wanting to start with an octave pedal, and spend under $75, this is the way to go.
I planned to keep mine. When used with the Donner Harmonizer, you get the added octave up, and it works great together. I honestly had no plans to keep the S&U. Until I heard it side by side, and I was amazed by the S&U pedal, so much that I changed my mind.
@howard, you may consider the Donner Harmonizer.
It is inexpensive at $45, and gives you not only the Up octave, it gives you the choice how much to go up. 2-4-5-7-9 semitones and 1 or 2 octaves. Plus you can take any of those Up / detune / or down. For an inexpensive, Mini pedal, it has good use and can fit many pedalboards.
The Donner is unavailable on Amazon, but this is the same thing, different name and color, but identical otherwise, and only $39.99 here in USA.
Or send me your address, I will send you mine, if shipping is reasonable.
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Very nice!
Basically the pinnacle goal for octavers
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Damn nice, I bet there is sooo much fun packed in that baby
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Wait a minute, are you challenging me? Hmmmm. I better find one of those MoogerFooger’s that @Gio says are beyond amazing.
Amazon has them for $4000
HA!!!
Idk why, they are like $249 or $449 on Reverb, I forget, I tend to think $449, otherwise I may have already had one.
Let the games begin… 
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I could imagine swapping out my Nether for a mini-POG but I don’t use the Nether enough to really justify it. My board is basically done at this point, I like it just like it is.
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So, @howard and @itsratso, and anybody else who may know.
What is the difference between the POG and the Sub n Up?
I know the POG is more “the standard”, it is popular and well known,
But
For the mini and the regular POG, it only has 3 controls, DRY, Sub Octave and Octave up
The Sub n Up has
DRY. - SUB 1 - SUB 2 UP
AND
Classic or Polymorphic toggle
And there are tone prints, which are fun, but the power is the tone print editor where you can really tweak this pedal.
So to me, who does not know, (this is why I am asking)
It appears that the
POG and mini POG are simple one octave up / down
TC Sub n Up has 3 octaves to play with, and alter ways to morph the sound (the poly is probably what the POG is and classic is a little tamer???)
And has the ability to really tweak out the settings
The Sub n up Mini has just Up / Down and dry, but toneprints and tone print editor
The POG2 has everything the Sub N Up (large) has right on the pedal
So, it appears that
The POG, POG mini and SUB n UP mini are about the same, where three are extra tweaks you can to to the Sub n Up mint, possibly giving it an edge? Or not?
I and the
Sub n Up and POG 2 have close to the same capabilities, but you can doo finer adjustments right on the POG 2 and you need a phone or iPad or computer to tweak the Sub n Up on the fly.
So, if what I am saying is correct, and it may be way wrong, please tell me if it is, that
AMAZON price - Reverb best price
Sub n Up mini (A) $119.99. ® $99.99
POG. (A) $173.99 ® $213.80
Nano POG (A) $286.99 ® $172.99
POG 2. (A) $399.99 ® $326.70
Sub n Up. (A) $129.99 ® $128.99
Looking at the prices, and capabilities, why would the Sub n Up not be ideal? Is it personal preference (it always is to an extent, but you know)
Is it EHX Fan club?
Is it TC Electric Hate club?
Is the POG clearly a superior pedal and product across the whole line that it is worth spending the money for it?
I am in no way criticizing this purchase, I think it is awesome. I am curious to know the driving factor, and to know more about the POG.
I can say that the Sub n Up is amazing pedal, and so much that I replaced the Nether that was a very good pedal, and combined with a Harmonizer for the octave up, sounded great, but the Sub n Up sounded Stellar and was my clear choice.
I think it kicks ass, but it boils down to a really long question to, do I need to go POG and ditch the Sub n Up, or is it adequate in comparrison.
IDK, help me understand please.
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