I tried to purchase this book TWICE on Amazon last night and both times it refused to download.
So I guess that’s all I need to know about music theory.
2 Likes
Well, there is always this to dig into:
Warning: heavy stuff, and might contain controversial views; but, really, lots of food for thought!
4 Likes
Usually not a “recommender,” but if it’s theory you’re looking for, this is a contender. This sat on my shelf for a year. After reading more reviews about how good it was, I opened it again. I don’t know why it didn’t make sense the first time (probably because it had words). Mind blowing. I couldn’t believe after all of these years of trying to figure out certain things, they were spelled out simply here. The formula for instantly figuring the Cycle of Fourths and Fifths, and instantly what sharps and flats were in a key, came in about 5 minutes/the first chapter.
As far as the Ariana Cap theory book (which has sat even longer), she knows hers stuff but relaying it to me caused my brain to nearly explode… the first person to P.M. a (U.S.) address can have that book (less dusting for me). To avoid getting multiple addresses, just say you want it here so others can see it’s gone, and then give me the info. privately. It will be sent tomorrow.
2 Likes
Cool. PM sent. Thanks, man!
1 Like
Don’t rely upon all books being acurate or helpful… I bought a music theory book that seemed really good until I realised they haven’t even constructed the major scale properly. I wrote to the company and they said it should have been picked up in editing. I thought, no, you should know the major scale if you’re teaching theory. I haven’t touched that book again as I had no way of knowing what else was wrong.
1 Like
I wrote this last night at Starbucks but then they were closing and i never got back to it…
<2 people discussing what they’re going to name chords when they add a 7th to a triad>
Person 1: Ok, the first one is easy we’re going to call it a Major 7th where the “major” refers to the 7th
Person 2: Ok, so then we’ll call it a Minor when it has a minor 7th?
P1: No, when it has a minor 7th we’re going to call it a Dominant 7th
P2: Well what’s a minor 7th then?
P1: That’s when it has a minor 3rd where the “minor” refers to the 3rd but it also has a minor 7th too 
P2: Ok, i’m afraid to ask but what are we going to call it when it has a minor 3rd, a b5 and a minor 7th?
P1: We’re going to call that a “half diminished” chord.
P2: Half? So the half-diminished refers to the flat 5th?
P1: Yes
P2: Ok, then what’s a full diminished chord… a double flat 5th?
P1: No, that’s when it has a minor 3rd, a diminished 5th and a diminished minor 7th
P2: OK, I’m done 
Ok, i’ve reread that several times, i’m still not sure i didnt make a mistake in there somewhere but times are tough and i can’t afford to employ an editor; you get what you pay for. 
the way that I remember them is
major 7th
dominant 7th = major 7th with a b7
minor 7th = dominant 7th with a b3
half diminished = minor 7th with a b5
The reason it’s a “dominant” is it’s based on the 5th degree of another scale eg C7 is the V7 of F major. It’s dominant because of it’s 3:2 relationship with the tonic and it drives the progression back to the tonic. To find the scale the V comes from you can use the rule of 9 and count down 5 or up 4.
It also happens that these 7th chords correspond to the notes from 4 of the modes, the ionian (major 7th), the mixolydian (dominant 7th), the aeolian (minor 7th) and the Locrian (half-diminished 7th aka m7 b5)
And this is why Howard and i recommend that people ignore this stuff until later because it’s just confusing, you probably won’t need it and you’ll probably forget it by the time you do need it.
3 Likes
It’s rooted in several hundred years of music going back to the Greeks, the church and classical western music… then it was patched up with more “modern” stuff like blues and jazz over the last 100 or so years.
It’s not like someone sat down and wrote a comprehensive guide to music theory, much of it relies on the fact that you already know theory to understand the theory Music theory is an evolution like most languages are. It’s not really intended to understand music, it’s intended to communicate music and a lot of it is open to interpretation, like most arts. If you want to understand music, you need to play (and play around with) music just as you need to speak a language and interact with people in it to really understand that language.
5 Likes
White supremacy is a stretch… it’s more that most of academia hangs onto the past and does not change unless it’s forced to… and the past for music means mostly white western music and more specifically classical music. In most music programs if you want to take jazz/bass, you have to learn upright first and you can’t just start on electric.
I grew up with Jewish music, I’ve never considered studying theory for it and I don’t care if schools don’t study it… if i wanted to, I’d find a program that taught that music theory. School is just the place you start your learning; there’s just too much different music theory out there to study all of it Schools look at what’s applicable to many/most of us and requires them to change the least. All arts are like that… dance, drawing/painting, photography… it’s mostly all based in white European history. If one looks at who first created universities, that should not be a big surprise.
It’s hard enough to get programs to change on things like technology and include relevant material that students will need in the workplace now. Most universities are really not that concerned with providing you the best education possible or preparing you for employment, they’re more interested in taking your money to fund research.
3 Likes
you must have a guardian angel 
1 Like
Well, yeah, you’d think that was Adam Neely’s version of a click bait title… but he has sources (articles, textbooks) that pretty much say so in so many words - so, not such a stretch after all…
But, agreed, laziness and inertia (also and especially in academia) has to do with this, with a generous dollop of ignorance and probably a decent pinch of convenience mixed in as well.
It would behoove us to be more aware of other approaches to music, not to necessarily learn and study them, but just to be… aware of them really. We are all “amateurs” here and want to make the music we can, and I am unlikely to dive into gamelan music any time soon, but it’s cool to try something more “out there” every once in a while and maybe risk to get inspired.
This is also a -centric view; mostly US-centric, I would say. Most universities here in Europe are public institutions and our struggles are a bit different.
3 Likes
Information is more accessible now than at any other time in human history and with enough effort, one can learn pretty much anything one wants to. 
I recommend this Ted talk if you’ve never seen it https://youtu.be/iG9CE55wbtY
1 Like
Yep, good ole Ken Robinson - have seen a couple of his videos!
I mean, the daily grind at university is killing my creativity - and I am supposed to motivate the kids… 
3 Likes
Oh certainly - universities are inherently conservative in many regards because they primarily serve to gather and codify existing knowledge. Not to mention that state-run unis are big ships and it take a long time to steer them in a new direction…
Oh yes, that too…
1 Like
I like the idea of school but hate being there. I love learning, I spend much of my days learning but school makes me not want to do it. I was on the PAC for the engineering program at the local college. It meets twice a year, in the fall and spring. I missed 2 meetings because I was out of town for work and when i made it to the next one, they were still discussing some program changes I’d suggested at the last meeting I’d been to
The first time I went to uni for computers, I quit after 2 years because I didn’t enjoy it and none of it was practical or aimed at getting a job. When I went back for engineering about 8 years later it was much better. I’ve never been good at doing school, Eng was the hardest thing I’ve ever done, more than half of my starting class didn’t graduate, but it was rewarding. Still, school is just the beginning of all the learning you need to do
2 Likes
I included this Winston Churchill quote in my PhD thesis:
“I am always willing to learn, although I do not always like to be taught” 
3 Likes
Oh yeah I taught English at uni for a few years but, thank God, I broke the cycle and escaped. The paperwork, the politics, the short-term contracts, the incessant complaining by old, burnt-out staff… This was seriously killing my mojo. I think what finally it for me was playing Time by Pink Floyd in a lesson…
In the words of Charlotte Bronte: "The thought came over me - am I to spend all the best part of my life in this wretched bondage, forcibly suppressing my rage at the idleness, the apathy and the hyperbolical and most assinine stupidity of those fat-headed oafs and on compulsion assuming an air of kindness patience and assiduity? Must I from day to day sit chained to this chair, prisoned within these four bare walls while these glorious summer suns are burning in heaven, and the year is revolving in its richest glow, and declaring at the close of every summer day [that] the time I am losing will never come again?”
5 Likes
It’s funny, I never graduated from high school because I was an English credit short, but I went to university and college twice. Several years after I finished engineering, I had applied to the RCMP and they required you to have graduated HS so I had to write the set of tests for the graduation equivalency diploma… it was ridiculously easy but it reminded me about all the ways that school makes learning a horrible, boring experience. In many cases schools still focus way too much on the wrong things; too much on finite knowledge and grades and not enough on how to learn effectively, critical thinking and problem solving. Even for engineering it’s probably 6 or 7 years since I had to do any math calculations…but I did have to do them to help my daughter with her home work, limiting reagent problems too… which I probably learned better in the process than when I took organic chem
I always hated theory in school, I just wanted to play music and theory wasn’t that useful because I was just going to read the sheet music. It’s like sitting down to study grammar, the only time anyone does that is when they’re trying to learn a second language. Ask any native English speaker if they can tell you the rules for the order adjectives go in and they probably don’t even know there is one. Music theory is a good tool for understanding or communicating music but if you don’t have a good way to learn it and a problem to solve, it’s going to be extremely difficult. If you want to learn theory, you need to use theory. The biggest things that contributed to my better understanding of music theory were 1. Learning to play the piano, 2. writing music, 3. answering other people’s theory questions. I think the main reason I was interested in theory, the problem I needed to solve was that I wanted to learn how to improvise.
1 Like