Middle C and the Bass

Here is a tidbit of information a lot of beginners may not know about, and a question I have often wondered about.

After you read the hi-lited text in the document below, can you tell me if fretboard diagrams, like that depicted in diagram A, that show where middle C is, compensate for the one octave shift when they are produced? I feel they must have but wondered what others thought.

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Middle C is C4. It’s the 17th fret on the G string of a bass, or the fifth fret of the G string of a guitar. So that fret chart is correct for a 6-string guitar in standard tuning.

Not all charts are, I have seen some that are an octave off; apparently the chart author did not know about the transposition (or did it wrong).

Even that one is a bit wonky in isolation; on the staff, it’s showing middle C on a piano score, not on a bass score. On a bass score it would be notated an octave higher, as it mentions in the text.

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My understanding is the the bass sounds one octave lower than is written on the score and that’s primarily to avoid excessive ledger lines.

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That’s correct, the bass is a transposing instrument, notated an octave higher than the notes it actually plays. So is the guitar.

This is common, lots of instruments transpose their notation. One reason you need to be careful using sheet music written for one instrument on a different instrument :slight_smile:

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Ok cool thanks; I’m glad some of this stuff is sticking in my head.

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Thank you @howard

The C4 notation apparently follows an ISO standard but not everybody follows that ruling.
Here is an interesting article I found regarding discrepancies in octave numbering.

Octave numbering confusion C1 C2 etc.pdf (17.7 KB)

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For those interested here is the ISO standards listing for octave numbering.

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If you want to be unambiguous about it, in A=440, Middle C is 261.6 Hz :slight_smile:

C4 is C4 because it’s the fourth C from the left on the Piano keyboard. Which is what the ISO used to standardize on. It’s “Middle C” because it’s the closest C to the middle of the Piano keyboard.

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I was surprised that Yamaha does not follow the ISO convention.

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Just checked and Yamaha says it is C3, you’re right. That’s just weird - most use C4 and a few use C5. Weird because they are one of the largest piano manufacturers in the world, too.

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As another lover of Yamaha Basses I thought this may strike you as strange :slightly_smiling_face:

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Tonight I was practicing over a “C” drone track when I randomly decided to find every “C” note on my bass neck. Then I thought, I wonder which one of these is middle C? Then I wondered why isn’t middle C the one that is one ledger line above the bass clef like the piano? And then I went to Google. And then found my BassBuzz friends had pondered this and answered all these questions beautifully 2 years ago. Thank you @Celticstar, @Howard, and @Barney for being you, I learned stuff :slight_smile:

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I think it’s about time we let an “AI” trawl over the entire BassBuzz forum history, and then we could ask questions to BassGPT :grin:
Alas, so far, we have to “make do” with @eric.kiser :sweat_smile: :joy:

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Consider that ChatGPT may be getting dumber Stanford Scientists Find That Yes, ChatGPT Is Getting Stupider

So it’s possible that eventually, BassGPT would end up just arguing with itself about tone wood and which flat wounds sound best :thinking:

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Yah but then that would free us up to talk about pizza.

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We already know Alder is the best tone wood. Nothing more that AI can add to that.

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Dude, all good children are already free to talk pizza to their heart’s content!

Just to see what it would say, I asked ChatGPT: “does tone wood matter for electric basses and if it does, what is the best tone wood”

and it told me:

Tone wood can also play a role in the sound of electric bass guitars, though its impact might be somewhat less pronounced compared to acoustic guitars. The construction and design of the bass, as well as the pickups and electronics, have a significant influence on the overall sound. That being said, some bass players do believe that the choice of tonewood can contribute to the instrument’s tone and character.

Some common tonewoods used for electric bass guitars and their general characteristics are:

1. Alder: Alder is a popular choice for electric bass bodies. It’s known for its balanced and resonant tone, with a good mix of lows, mids, and highs. Many classic Fender basses use alder bodies.

2. Ash: Ash is another common option for bass bodies. It can have a pronounced and bright top end, along with strong sustain. It’s often associated with a slightly more open and airy sound.

3. Maple: Maple necks are widely used on both basses and guitars. Maple necks can add brightness and snap to the overall sound. The density and grain of the maple can influence the character of the instrument.

4. Mahogany: Mahogany can provide warmth and a strong midrange, making it a good choice for players seeking a richer, deeper tone.

5. Swamp Ash: Swamp ash is a variation of ash with a lighter weight and a unique tonal character. It can offer a balanced tone with a slight emphasis on the upper midrange.

6. Basswood: Basswood is often chosen for its lightweight properties and balanced tone. It can be a good option for players looking for a neutral canvas that can be shaped by pickups and electronics.

Ultimately, the “best” tone wood for an electric bass guitar is a matter of personal preference and the sound you’re trying to achieve. The choice of pickups, electronics, and amplification also significantly contribute to the final sound. It’s a good idea to try out different basses with various tonewoods to see which one complements your playing style and sonic preferences.

:slight_smile:

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:joy:

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But if your little AI friend would have consulted the oracle i.e Embellisher they would realize it’s missing the fundamentals or low mids.

Also :slight_smile:

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